How to balance a 9-5 and running your own business

During the pandemic, when clubbing and partying were put on hold, many of us turned to hosting good old-fashioned game and quiz nights to stay connected.

Being among those searching for entertainment and a little fun, Nicola Robinson and Tolu Abisogun both had the idea to seize this opportunity and create a new cheeky drinking games brand—they just didn’t know each other yet.

Fate seemed to bring these 2 founders together as their mutual friends connected them and they set out to develop their concept into what would become Berserk Games.

While both still working full time jobs, they navigated everything from product research and finding manufacturers, to marketing strategies and working their way up the Amazon ranks.

Their shock factor games quickly disrupted the industry, resulting in a viral TikTok video, and rocketing them to success in both the UK and the US.

Despite challenges and juggling their 9-5 jobs, they have embraced their unique backgrounds and triumphed as founders, proving that side hustles can lead to life changing incomes.

Here is their unfiltered advice below:

• When fate brings together 2 founders with the same vision
• Finding a reliable and affordable manufacturer on Alibaba
• How to make sales in the early days
• What kind of card games do Berserk Games sell?
• Test your product and get feedback from your target market
• Juggling your 9-5 and working a side hustle
• Your confidence will grow as the business does
• Starting with £2,000 and solid backup plans
• Breaking into the US market with a viral TikTok video
• Battling the loneliness epidemic with card games
• You can’t grow as a person or as a business without making mistakes
• Side hustle money could result in you getting on the property ladder quicker
• From foster care to founder
• Building a business to inspire and help children in care
• Applying economics to the real business world
• Will the changing landscape of drinking culture affect the business and future products?
• Balance creativity with level-headedness
• Make a plan so you can see your ideas come to life

When fate brings together 2 founders with the same vision

Bex Burn-Callander:

So tell us the story then. So it’s the midst of the pandemic, everyone’s stuck at home, and you guys are like, “Right, let’s start a business.” So take me through the thought process.

Tolu Abisogun:

So I can start. I think I speak for Nicola and myself when I say that we’ve both always wanted to start a business. We just never knew what the right business would be, and when the business was registered, I was 21.

Not much has changed, but I always loved a good games night, whether it’s hosting or attending one, because it’s such a great way to meet people and just have a lot of fun.

But at the time, there wasn’t much competition. There weren’t many games that were that good, and I noticed it was pretty easy to put 1 and 1 together and start a business.

I noticed this gap, so I definitely wanted to start something within that industry.

Then luckily, we had a mutual friend who noticed that we’re both going through the same thoughts in terms of wanting to start something similar.

And then she connected us, which was great.

Bex Burn-Callander:

So you met through this venture, you weren’t friends previously?

Tolu Abisogun:

No. Yeah.

Bex Burn-Callander:

That’s amazing. And you found that that’s been actually a really straightforward partnership, and you really bonded through that urge to be entrepreneurs?

Tolu Abisogun:

From our first conversation, I just knew that the partnership made sense.

So yes, it’s been great since we started.

Bex Burn-Callander:

And Nicola, tell me about the competitive landscape then, because I haven’t played drinking games for a long time or party games, but I remember them being super cringe.

So were you also trying to find games that were more your speed and finding that the actual games that you could get your hands on were missing something, or were maybe not quite catered to your age, or your particular interests?

Nicola Robinson:

Yeah. So when I was at university, we just made up drinking games with a standard deck of cards.

But the point when I decided to start a drinking card game business was, I ordered a beer pong set for my birthday, and it came with the cups, the balls, and a drinking game, but it was written in such bad English. It was still fun to play, but the cards were really rubbish.

And I thought, “I could do this, I can do it better.”

And that’s what inspired me to start thinking about how can I do this and how can I start this business?

As Tolu said, we have a mutual friend and I was telling my friend about this, and she was like, “Oh, one of my friends has basically the same idea.”

So then we set up a call and had a chat about it and decided to work together.

Bex Burn-Callander:

If you didn’t believe in fate before, you will after hearing this story.

Finding a reliable and affordable manufacturer on Alibaba

Bex Burn-Callander:

So then what were the next steps? What is the path you follow when you’re trying to create a game? Is it playing around in Canva, or is it trying to work out a marketing plan or trying to figure out where you can get them printed?

Tell me what your steps were to actually go from idea to reality.

Tolu Abisogun:

So yes, I’d say in the beginning it was about knowing what sort of game we wanted to create in the first place.

So we agreed on this 3-in-1 drinking game, because it was so different to what was already on offer on Amazon and stuff like that.

So it was about knowing the product that we wanted to create and then actually writing questions for it, doing the designs for it, working with a designer to get it produced, and then looking for manufacturers.

Nicola was really great with that. She can speak on that.

Nicola Robinson:

Yeah, so I think in the first instance we looked in the UK, but UK manufacturers were really expensive, especially for the small quantities. So then we decided to outsource.

So I started looking for manufacturers in China. And I did this through Alibaba.

So it was a case of sending a brief to probably about 20 different card game manufacturers in China and then seeing who would be the most reliable, and who would give us the most cost-effective price for it as well.

It just went from there and we built up relationships with a couple of factories and then decided to use one, and they’ve been really great since.

Bex Burn-Callander:

How did you determine they’d be reliable? Did you manage to speak to anyone else that worked with them or were there reviews that you thought were quite trustworthy? How did you figure out which of this pack? Because that’s quite a lot of options to have to start with.

Nicola Robinson:

So Alibaba does quite a good job at verifying manufacturers, and they have basically a tiered system of how approved certain manufacturers are.

So I did a lot of research into that and the different accreditations that manufacturers can have. I also spoke to them and read reviews about them.

So there was quite a good picture that formed around them, and speaking to them as well, they were really responsive. They responded so quickly and they’re very on top of everything.

So yeah, it was a little bit of a gamble. It could have gone wrong, but at the same time we did our due diligence and they were really good.

Tolu Abisogun:

Just to add to that, getting samples as well is probably the best thing. So we did get samples in the beginning just to make sure that they were the right fit for us.

And the samples that we received back were great, so we knew this was the manufacturer we would work with.

Bex Burn-Callander:

So try before you buy, great advice.

How to make sales in the early days

Bex Burn-Callander:

And then how did you start making sales? Because you can have the best product in the world, but no one knows who you are, no one even maybe knows that they even want what you are making. So how did you bridge that gap?

Nicola Robinson:

So in the first instance, we had a launch party.

So it was in my house at the time. We just invited a bunch of friends and family over to play our games and they really liked it. We had a really good time. It was really fun.

So that gave us the confidence to launch on social media and make a plan. So our first sales came through friends, and then it was friends sharing on social media.

Then we started launching campaigns on TikTok as well, and we put the products on Amazon. So yeah, the early days it was the support of friends and family before it went wider.

Bex Burn-Callander:

I definitely want to hear about how you made the products a success on Amazon and also the campaign on TikTok. Because there’s so many videos, there’s so much content on there.

How did you make it stand out? Was it literally just showing people playing and having a good time, or was there a cleverer more salesy, soft salesy way of actually getting people to click, “I want to buy this?”

Tolu Abisogun:

I think from a marketing perspective, because of the cards themselves, there’s this sort of shock factor when you read some of the questions.

So that was really good for our marketing, because when you go on TikTok and you see a question that might be quite relatable to you or might be quite funny or you might think of a friend, that gets people to look on our page and look through our other products.

Then from there there’s a lot of cross-platform. So if they go on our TikTok, they might search the game on Amazon. That’s what happened a lot as well. So we found that to be pretty good for us.

What kind of card games do Berserk Games sell?

Bex Burn-Callander:

Tell us about the games. So for the people listening who maybe haven’t heard of Berserk and haven’t played, what’s on offer and maybe give me an example of the kind of shock factor questions that you are referring to.

Tolu Abisogun:

So we sell drinking games, couples games, party games, stuff like that.

We’ve got Truth or Dare, we’ve even got a PDF print and play game as well.

So yeah, we do have a range of 6 products that are all very good.

And the questions can be quite daring, should I say.

On Brutal Hangover, there’s a lot about know ex-partners and stuff like that. And then we’ve got our couple games, which encourage intimacy.

So I think we just hit the nail on the head in terms of being able to get that customer reaction, and it works really well.

Test your product and get feedback from your target market

Bex Burn-Callander:

I’ve read your testimonials and I’ve seen from your press release that there are people who really love the games that you’ve created.

But how did you put together the questions? Because you’re not 50 years old having spent 40 years in the games industry or even in understanding human psychology and doing stuff from that angle.

So how did you hit the nail on the head with the questions?

Nicola Robinson:

So at the time, Tolu was a student, I just graduated, so we were our target audience.

We were at university at the time basically making up these kind of questions and hosting games nights and things like that ourselves. So it kind of came naturally to us.

We also did a lot of research around different types of questions and what could be put in. We looked at what competitors had in their games and what we thought worked well and what didn’t.

But a lot of it was just being creative and asking friends what they thought of certain questions.

With some of our products, like our couple’s game, we took a chance.

But yeah, we did have some friends that we asked to test it and write full feedback on it. So that really helped, and we did adapt based on feedback we got from people.

Bex Burn-Callander:

That was what I was going to ask, is how many iterations have there been? Have you had feedback where you’ve been like, “Right, let’s just get rid of that card and add this card,” or can you pretty much say that the first decks that you created have stayed pretty constant throughout?

Tolu Abisogun:

Yeah, I’d say they’ve stayed pretty constant. There might be the odd card that we might change, but from when we launched our initial product, there isn’t too much change between then and now, which is good.

So we do try and get it right the first time.

Juggling your 9-5 and working a side hustle

Bex Burn-Callander:

Do you guys still have day jobs? And tell me about that.

How do you manage a business that’s growing this fast alongside a full-time job, and what is it that you take from your day job that has been useful in your side hustle?

Nicola Robinson:

A lot of what I’ve learned at work I’ve used in my business. So it’s been really useful, because as I’ve gone through my career, a lot of the skills I’ve picked up, I’ve then been using those to create Berserk Games.

It is hard work doing both because it is like having a part-time/full-time job at times. But yeah, it just requires being really organised and scheduling.

I guess things like waking up early, working on Berserk Games before I go to work and then probably doing a little bit in the evening.

But yeah, it’s just careful planning and organisation, and it also just makes you prioritise a little bit more. Sometimes you can’t do everything, so yeah, we prioritise. And then we also outsource some things.

So for example, now we have a team of content creators, so we don’t do as much content creating ourselves, so that frees up some of our time.

So it’s just a case of how can we grow the business while spending as little time on it as possible.

Tolu Abisogun:

For me, I’d say it’s definitely not for the weak. It is tough, to be honest.

And from when I graduated, I’ve changed roles over time, and I feel like the roles that I have been in, I’ve learned something from each that I could add to Berserk Games.

So I think that’s a really valuable thing in terms of having a 9-to-5 at the same time. But growing a business and having a 9-to-5, it definitely isn’t easy.

It does feel like you’re working 24/7, but at the same time it’s what I enjoy doing. I would say I don’t really have much free time because my free time is spent in the business, but that’s not something that I mind, because it’s something I’m passionate about.

Bex Burn-Callander:

When you say you’ve taken something from each role that you’ve had since graduating, can you give me a concrete example of a transferable skill?

Tolu Abisogun:

So I’d say, when I graduated, I got into a graduate scheme in project management at a bank, and that really helped at the beginning in terms of structuring of admin, which is obviously really basic, but there’s a lot of things that you just don’t know.

And that role really taught me a lot in terms of just operationally how to write things, how to translate things in terms of having meetings as well and how to conduct those.

So that definitely helped with how we’ve grown up until this point.

Your confidence will grow as the business does

Bex Burn-Callander:

Did you always feel really confident that this business would succeed, or do you feel like the confidence has grown as you’ve reached different milestones, and the business has taken on a life of its own? Where does the confidence in its future come from?

Tolu Abisogun:

Well, for me, honestly, it’s been a ‘fake it until you make it’ situation. I had no idea how well this business would do, but I always knew that I was going to do really well at something, I just didn’t know what.

And I’m so happy that this is the business that has done well.

So I’ve just always had this ambition I’d say since I was really young, like 13, 14. I’ve always been writing a business plan, trying to make something work for myself.

So I’d say a mixture of ambition and a bit of delusion has led me to be quietly confident about this business.

Nicola Robinson:

So for me, I wasn’t very confident to start it out, but I was ambitious. And I guess same as Tolu, I always wanted to start a business and I knew I’d succeed at something even if it wasn’t this.

But I invested a lot of my personal time in developing my skills. I watched a lot of YouTube videos, I read a lot of books. I put the hours in and then we started having success.

And I guess as we’ve had more and more success, my confidence has grown.

And now we look back at all that we’ve done, and it’s like, “Wow, we’ve actually done so much.”

But I definitely wouldn’t say I started confident, but I’ve grown to be more confident.

Starting with £2,000 and solid backup plans

Bex Burn-Callander:

And that startup pot, am I right that it’s about £2,000 that you started with, and was that like, did you each put a £1000 in?

Nicola Robinson:

Yeah.

Bex Burn-Callander:

Was that sort of savings at the time? And how did you keep costs low? Because that’s not a huge amount of money to start a product-based business.

Nicola Robinson:

So at the time, as I said, I just graduated, Tolu was still a student, so we put in £2,000.

But it felt like a lot of money to us at the time. And yeah, it was our savings essentially.

And we placed a first order of 1,000 units and then we spent some money on Amazon and a little bit of money on marketing. But I guess when we were spending that money, we were like, we need this to succeed.

We had our plan A, our plan B and our plan C in case it didn’t succeed, but it did.

Then we ended up putting another £2,000 in because we actually sold out of our first batch of stock within, I think it was a few months, and the lead times on shipping are about 2 months.

So yeah, about a month to a month and a half in we’re like, “Oh my god, should we put more money into this business?” And at the time it was like, “Oh my god, this is literally everything we have.”

But then it was so successful and it grew from there.

Bex Burn-Callander:

That’s amazing that you took the risk but had the plan B and the plan C.

I want to know what the plan B and the plan C were. What were you going to do if people weren’t buying the games? Were you going to sell them wholesale somewhere or pulp them?

Nicola Robinson:

So plan A I guess was Amazon and it was our website. So then we thought maybe we could flog something on eBay. We thought potentially we could do a market store to get rid of the stock, things like that basically. Give them to charity shops if needed.

Bex Burn-Callander:

Well, luckily you didn’t have to do any of that.

Breaking into the US market with a viral TikTok video

Bex Burn-Callander:

What’s super interesting about your brand is that you are big in the UK but also in the States and Canada, and there’s not that many British product startups that seem to really be a hit on both sides of the pond, especially not in the early days.

Was that just an organic thing or did you make a conscious play for the US consumer? How did you find that success over the pond?

Tolu Abisogun:

We always knew that we wanted to go global, but obviously we had to focus on the UK first. And then naturally, especially on Amazon, it was doing really well on Amazon UK.

So when we launched on Amazon US, and it all just followed suit naturally, which was great.

We’ve also partnered with content creators in Canada and in the US and other brands and podcasts as well, so that’s really helped with our brand awareness.

So it was just trying these different things to see how far we could reach on the other side of the pond. But I’d say Amazon was definitely really great for us.

Bex Burn-Callander:

Okay, that’s interesting.

Nicola Robinson:

Just to add to that as well, I guess with Amazon on the US, it wasn’t a hit straight away.

We definitely found it a lot harder to stock because there was so much more competition in the US. There’s so many more drinking games out there.

And we had the stock in the warehouse for a few months, and we’re only selling 1 or 2 units and it was really slow.

Then we had a breakthrough of our marketing.

So we were trying to push it on TikTok and we created a separate US TikTok account, but it was a bit slow.

And then at one point on our UK account, after we hired a US content creator, but one of their videos went viral and that completely changed the game for us.

And with Amazon, your ranking depends on how much you sell. So because we had that viral video, our sales rates shot up.

So then we established our ranking, and from then that kind of solidified our place in the US Amazon market.

Bex Burn-Callander:

What was in the video that went viral?

Tolu Abisogun:

Honestly, not loads. So it was mainly the content creator, and I think she might have put some text on the screen just to draw people in.

Then she just showed the cards, as I mentioned before, that shock factor.

The US, they have a drinking culture over there as well, so I think it really played into what they like.

Battling the loneliness epidemic with card games

Bex Burn-Callander:

I’d love to know whether you think that post-pandemic, the need for games like this that bring people together and help forge bonds, even between strangers, that you’ve sort of hit on a zeitgeist in a weird way.

We seem to be in a loneliness epidemic in the UK, and it’s not just the elderly, but young people are claiming high rates of loneliness.

So do you feel like you had this great idea, but it also just happens to be culturally what people are crying out for?

Tolu Abisogun:

I’d say especially during Covid, that definitely did actually help our business. Because a lot of people were just at home, they didn’t have much to do. You wanted to spend more time with friends or family within your house.

So getting a card game was really great for that.

And as you mentioned, a lot of people are really lonely and they’re coming more like, that fact is more evident as we get older.

And our games definitely encourage people to get to know each other better on a deeper level as well, which is really great.

So I feel like Covid has definitely helped, but then also just being aware of what people are actually dealing with and ways that we can actually help them.

You can’t grow as a person or as a business without making mistakes

Bex Burn-Callander:

Oh, that’s really interesting. Did you make any mistakes? Is there anything looking back that you wish you’d done differently?

Tolu Abisogun:

For me personally, not really.

Just because I feel like we started this business when we were quite young. We’re not going to know everything. Even if we were much older starting, you’re not going to know everything.

Starting a business is all about trial and error, learning from your mistakes. Yeah, there are certain things that we wish we knew, and wish we’d implemented from the beginning, but how do you grow as a person or as a business, it’s inevitable that you’re going to make mistakes.

So I personally wouldn’t say I have any regrets and I don’t think I would’ve done anything differently. Looking back at how we launched, probably be pretty similar to the way we launched.

Nicola Robinson:

I agree with what Tolu said.

I guess there are things that maybe starting a business again, we would do maybe slightly differently. But in general, overall, there’s nothing big that I wish we would’ve done differently.

But I guess for me, the small things maybe would’ve been things like paying more attention to policies of third-party retailers, or maybe using a few more experts along the way.

So for example, with our content, we edit a lot of the content ourselves and the images, and that takes hours. But we probably could have outsourced that task, and it wouldn’t have cost that much and it would’ve saved us a lot of time.

So small things like that. But in terms of our overall business journey, there’s nothing I wish we could completely change.

Bex Burn-Callander:

And sometimes taking that time and being really painstaking about being involved in every step of the product creation ends up being useful down the line anyway, because not only do you get how it’s done, but you are also completely invested and it’s totally on you, which is a next level of accountability, I suppose.

Side hustle money could result in you getting on the property ladder quicker

Bex Burn-Callander:

Just talking to you both, it’s clear that you are both really driven, really focused on making this a success and yourselves a success. So I want to talk to you both separately about your lives and how you’ve built resilience.

I’m going to start with you, Nicola, if that’s okay. So tell me about the experiences that have shaped you as an entrepreneur and how you have, I guess, learned to be a resilient person.

Nicola Robinson:

I guess from when I was young, I was always really ambitious, and I always wanted to do better. I grew up quite poor.

So for me, I guess I always wanted to change my lifestyle. So I went to university, I was pushed by my parents to go.

And then after university, I got my grad job, but then I thought, “What else can I do?”

It started with small, little side hustles that I did.

For example, I tried to resell tickets at one point. That didn’t go that well. I might have made a couple hundred quid. It probably wasn’t worth the time, but I tried.

Then I used to tutor a lot, so I used to tutor in my free time. And then we started Beserk Games.

For me it was a case I was trying to, I guess, better my life and I thought, “What more can I do and how can I level myself up?”

So that drive and ambition has I guess led me or led us to be quite successful now.

Bex Burn-Callander:

And just on that, do you feel, Nicola, like you are more secure now in having this second string to your bow in terms of income?

Has that made a big difference or is it more that you’re hoping it will make a big difference down the line that you invest this time and effort, though?

Nicola Robinson:

It’s definitely made a big difference to my life. I was able to buy my own property at 23, which I wouldn’t have been able to do had I not started the business.

So it has changed my life. It’s made my life more comfortable.

Now I’m doing other projects, and I would like to be a full-time entrepreneur down the line. So yeah, I guess it’s all steps I’m taking to try and achieve that.

From foster care to founder

Bex Burn-Callander:

That’s amazing. And Tolu, to you, because you’ve had a really interesting and quite challenging, at points, life. Do you mind sharing a bit about your journey and how that shaped you as an entrepreneur?

Tolu Abisogun:

So I grew up in foster care from a baby up until 18 years old, and I moved around a lot. I wouldn’t say I had a family growing up, which is really tough.

I remember I was literally in my last year of sixth form, and I was living in a hostel, and I was on benefits, and that type of life, most people wouldn’t experience.

So it definitely feels like I was thrown into the deep end, and it’s been quite difficult to get out of that. But from a really young age, I’ve just always known that I wanted to be successful.

For some reason as well, I’ve been hyper aware to the statistics surrounding children in care and care leavers, statistics that most people aren’t aware of.

For example, 25% of the homeless population have experienced care, which I think is absolutely insane. So stats like that have driven me, because I know I wanted to be on the complete opposite end of that. So that’s driven me in all areas of my life growing up, whether it’s sports, academia, business or corporate. It’s definitely just been a fuel for me.

And I’ve always just said to myself that I knew, and I know, that I will make something of myself. It’s not a matter of if but when. So it definitely does drive me, but it has been tough.

Bex Burn-Callander:

Do you feel like not having that family unit has made you that much more conscious than I suppose many people of how hard you have to rely on yourself and that you are the only agent of change in your life basically?

Tolu Abisogun:

That fact has played a lot in my head growing up, knowing that I literally can’t fall back on anyone if I ever need anything. Because it’s like I have to sort it out completely on my own.

And especially for care leavers, there isn’t much support out there. You’re sort of left to your own devices with a completely empty couch flat when you’re like 17, 18 years old, and it’s really tough.

Just being an adult is hard, but being a teenager and having to manage your own home and do all these things that people around you aren’t having to do, they might have some support from family and stuff like that. It can be quite difficult.

Being honest, the majority of care leavers aren’t able to work it out for themselves, understandably. Thankfully, for some reason I feel like I’ve just been born with this drive, and one day I want to be able to use that to help other care leavers and stuff.

Building a business to inspire and help children in care

Bex Burn-Callander:

Yeah, I want to talk about that, because it gives you this platform when you have a successful business. Because not only if the business stands on its own two feet, you then have resources to actually make a difference, whether that’s through giving a percentage of profits or just being a platform where you could promote other charities.

So tell me what you would love to do, maybe stuff that you’re doing baby steps now, but stuff that you would like to contribute in terms of helping other kids and people who’ve come through the care system.

Tolu Abisogun:

So previously I’ve been really gung-ho about raising awareness about children in care and care leavers. So I have appeared on the BBC, BBC Two as well and radio and stuff like that, just talking about our experiences.

But in the future I’d say, I want to be successful to a point where I can start my own program or offer funding or something like that, just to create some sort of result for care leavers specifically to be able to come to and know they can get some help.

Whether it’s therapy or some money or just something. Because I know exactly how it feels to go through life and not have anything and not have anyone to turn to.

So I definitely want to bridge that gap for them. I wouldn’t say I’m at that point yet.

Berserk is doing well, but I definitely need to make a lot more money to make the difference that I want to make. So hopefully soon, very soon.

Bex Burn-Callander:

I think you are probably underestimating the difference you can make just by being a visible woman who has come through the system and is standing on her own two feet and is really ambitious and bold about her future.

I think that’s probably quite a lot to be starting with just to be visible doing that and talking about your beginning. So I wouldn’t sell yourself short on that scale.

Applying economics to the real business world

Bex Burn-Callander:

Then Nicola, am I right, you did a degree in economics, is that true? Now, what does a degree in economics actually teach you about running a business? Because I want to know how much of that is stuff that you can really put to work in your business building and how much of it is lofty, over there, or were you really studying things like unit economics and stuff that was really applicable to Berserk?

Nicola Robinson:

I’d say the things I probably learned in the first year were quite applicable to the business. So we did some modules in accountancy, we did some modules in law, we did some business modules. So those were quite relevant to starting a business.

But to be honest, with second year and final year of uni, it gets quite in depth and it’s a lot of theory. I struggled with my degree, especially in the final year.

So I probably didn’t take in a lot of what we learned in final year, but I think A level and first year of uni economics, I think those are the most applicable sections of the course to real life business.

And some of those skills are skills I still use today and that have helped me succeed in business.

Will the changing landscape of drinking culture affect the business and future products?

Bex Burn-Callander:

What about the future of Berserk? So you said you’ve got 6 products, is that right? Do you feel under pressure to keep making new ones? Is this enough for now?

Talk to me about the plan for the future.

Tolu Abisogun:

I think definitely for this year and a little bit of next year, what we have right now is enough, and we want to make sure that a lot of homes in the UK have our products.

When people think about drinking games, there isn’t really a company that comes to mind. So we want to build ourselves up to be that company.

Just like a lot of homes have Monopoly, we want them to have something by Berserk Games. So that’s what we’re working towards.

And then I guess in the future we still want to obviously grow overseas, so America, Canada, and then potentially launching in Australia as well at some point.

So we do have a lot of big growth goals, so watch this space.

Bex Burn-Callander:

And the drinking game genre, do you ever get any backlash, or are you ever worried that when you read the statistics about how many young people, for example, are not drinkers, they don’t really go out, they’re not sociable, does that worry you in terms of a possible trend that could be challenging, or do you actually feel like there are enough people out there that still want to play drinking games?

Tolu Abisogun:

Do you know what, I feel like I know that there are a lot of people that want to stop drinking and stuff like that, and I definitely understand, but especially within the UK, we do have a drinking culture.

I did read somewhere that 72% of people drink. I don’t see that statistic really going down too much anytime soon.

So I wouldn’t say it’s much of a problem for us, but if it ever does become one, it wouldn’t be an issue for us to release a game that’s great for non-drinkers as well.

I feel like as a business we’re quite good at adapting. So that could potentially happen.

Bex Burn-Callander:

Are you constantly jotting down ideas for future games? Are you calling each other, WhatsApping, being like, “Oh, I’ve got it. I’ve got the next smash hit?”

Tolu Abisogun:

We definitely exchange ideas a lot, especially me. I’d say Nicola’s very much, she’s really smart, she’s very much like, money, money, money, like Tolu remain focused. You have all these ideas, which is great, but just remain focused, which I really love about her.

So yeah, so we do have lots of ideas and stuff, but we do just want to remain focused and grow what we currently have and make sure that’s big enough before we start adding other things to the mix.

Balance creativity with level-headedness

Bex Burn-Callander:

Can you each tell me something that you really, I don’t know, value and appreciate about the entrepreneurial skill or even just personal abilities of the other person? Yeah, I want to hear that.

Tolu Abisogun:

So Nicola, she’s really great, but obviously she studied economics. But aside from that, she’s really great with finance and accounting, and that’s really important when it comes to running a business obviously.

She’s really great with e-commerce and she really led with Amazon too, so I do appreciate having her as part of the team, because we definitely wouldn’t have grown to where we are today without her.

And it’s also really good to have someone who is super level-headed, and their focus is our revenue and our financial growth as well. So that’s really helped our business.

Nicola Robinson:

One thing that I really value working with Tolu, she’s so creative and she’s so good at the marketing side of the business. She’s had some amazing ideas, like TikTok videos and also PR and influencer activity.

So that’s really good. Because that really compliments me, because I’m more focused on the numbers and the hard business stuff, whereas obviously for a business to be successful, you do need to market it and you do need a lot of creativity as well around that.

And Tolu is amazing at that side of the business.

Bex Burn-Callander:

This is such a lovely moment. It’s like a mutual appreciation society, but do you ever disagree and have there been any big disagreements, and how did you resolve it?

Tolu Abisogun:

Yeah, we don’t agree on everything. I wouldn’t say we’ve had any major disagreements that have really affected our relationship, which is great.

So I feel like we’re really good at communicating and just getting our points across.

But I think it’s good to have disagreements, to be honest, because you get to learn different perspectives, you’re able to adapt, compromise, and then create something even better in the end. It’s not great to just have a yes man, to be honest.

So I think the different perspectives is really good for us.

Make a plan so you can see your ideas come to life

Bex Burn-Callander:

Then just finally, I just want to leave with a little bit of advice if you don’t mind sharing it.

For anyone who’s listening, who is perhaps in their twenties, like you were when you started Berserk Games, what would you tell them in order to get off to a flying start?

What is it that they should be focusing on? Is there a particular industry that you think is right for innovation? What would you tell another 20-something who’s like, “Right, I want to be a success.”

Nicola Robinson:

For me, it’d be like just take small steps, so think about what your current skill set is and think about I guess what you can do to monetise that. And I think anyone can start a successful business.

But I think the key to starting a successful business is definitely planning and educating yourself, and also sometimes making the right connections and the right contacts and putting yourself out there a little bit.

I recommend going to networking events like YouTube videos, it’s amazing how much you can learn on YouTube.

And read books and make sure you have a solid business plan and have a plan A, plan B, plan C.

Bex Burn-Callander:

That sounds like a full-time job in itself.

Wake up, have breakfast, watch YouTube videos, then do your planning in the afternoon, and then out in the evenings networking with people that could help the business thrive. That’s full ball.

Nicola Robinson:

It’s a full-time job. It’s definitely a big commitment.

I probably thought about starting a business or starting this particular business maybe 2 years before I did it. So I wanted to start an Amazon business. I just didn’t know what product to do.

But I did so much research into how Amazon businesses work, and I spent about 2 years researching it till I actually had the idea.

And then it went quite quickly from there, but it went quite quickly because I’d already done so much pre-work to it.

Bex Burn-Callander:

Amazing. And you Tolu?

Tolu Abisogun:

Similar to what Nicola said, I would say plan. That is the most important thing, even if you’re hearing this right now, start right now.

You need to plan your business plan that needs to be written, marketing plan, financial plan. Create a life plan.

You just need a plan, because if you don’t plan, then what are you actually going to do?

Personally, I feel like you need to see your vision, whether it’s on Word or on paper or something. It just needs to be written down, as you’re more likely to achieve it as well if it is written down.

For me, I’d say plan, that’s it.

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